User:Mariewalton/Previous Discussion (2012-2014)

MediaWiki:Edittools and MediaWiki talk:Edittools
I like to ask you about adding templates within the standard suite category, a category that appears at the bottom of the page that is intended to be transcribe. I am not too familiar with all the variety of templates that could be used when transcribing a print. I like to add template such as {gap} to the standard suit list. Are there instructions that explain how to add templates to the standard suit category? Perhaps, I can create a template list which will appear on the side panel under toolbar when I signed on to transcribe a doc.

Thanks for the email, as per your request I have added gap to Mediawiki:Edittools, and if you have requests for really common commands, then either request on the talk page, at Scriptorium or on a fellow admin's talk page. There are a number of cheats that we each use for our common editing commands, though as a bit of a (lazy) dinosaur, mine are old-fashioned in implementation and not been updated. What I am going to do, I going ask one of our admins who is better in the coordinated help space to look at your email and see how we might be able to handle this better for fresh blood. (To note that I have added your page to my watchlist, so do feel that you can reply here and I will note it) — billinghurst  sDrewth  02:26, 14 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Hi. A lot of common templates are listed at Help:Templates.  There is no current help page regarding the edit tools standard suite but I might add one soon.  The list of templates should cover most things.  If there is anything missing, please tell me.  If there is anything else that is unclear, please tell me that as well so I can create more help pages. - AdamBMorgan (talk) 13:01, 14 September 2012 (UTC)

The Perth Gazette
In response to your email: I know very little of html and css, so I can't advise you on how to re-create the wikisource-specific templates that I used for the lines. By the way, in most works we don't bother with columns because the way they work in the mainspace makes works almost impossible to read. The one exception is these older newspapers—and even then there is some debate as to whether we should be reproducing the original layout or focusing on the text. Beeswaxcandle (talk) 09:23, 16 September 2012 (UTC)

The mysterious Header toggle button
When proofreading in the Page: namespace and one has their toolbar turned on &#91;Gadgets, one will see the button, and clicking it toggles the header/footer on and off. In this space we put the relevant components for top and bottoms of pages, usually by use of the template RunningHeader, so for example produces I personally have my header/footer set to open in the Page: namespace and I achieved this by activating that option in my Gadgets. To also note that at this time, the use of the newer Wikieditor toolbar (Editing tab in My preferences) does not yet display all the tools that we utilise for proofreading. If you turn it off in your preferences you access the older toolbar and more editing options. — billinghurst  sDrewth  10:28, 19 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Oh dear, that is an older text addition and I need to modernise it for some of the latest tidying, I hope it mostly makes sense. — billinghurst  sDrewth  10:31, 19 September 2012 (UTC)

Complete Confectioner
Hi, this is a fairly straight-forward text, so it doesn't need the complex table based formatting that you are doing. Have a look at the way I did print pages 1 to 3 and use this as a guide for the other pages. Beeswaxcandle (talk) 09:31, 22 September 2012 (UTC)

Reply: Complete Confectioner
Thanks for tip! I tried it on page 17th of the text, and will continue to use it so forth. So, the formatting of the text as it appears in the image seldom matters. When should aligning paragraphs {align text:justify} be used?


 * The work that you're currently doing is in the Page namespace. This is a subsidiary area of Wikisource and when you've finished, we'll help you "transclude" the pages into the Main namespace. The Main namespace is where the general reader will read the work and the paragraphs can be automatically justified there, depending on the layout chosen by the reader. By way of example, have a look at a work I've recently been proofreading. First have a look at the pages in Index:Rambles in New Zealand.djvu, then have a look at the transcluded work Rambles in New Zealand. For this particular work, Layout 1 works quite well, but on the left hand side of your screen you should have a box titled "display options", in which the first link will say Layout 1. Click that, so it changes to Layout 2 and have a look at the way the text is now justified and has changed to a serif font. If you click the link again, you'll change to Layout 3, which moves the justified column to the left and changes back to a san-serif font. At present there are only three of these "dynamic layouts", but another couple are in development. To return to your underlying question, what we are doing in the Page namespace is proofreading the text and making sure that formatting such as italics, bold, centering and the like are sorted out. We also want to make sure that the paragraph breaks come in the right places, but we leave the look on the page to the mainspace. Beeswaxcandle (talk) 00:12, 23 September 2012 (UTC)


 * You've been doing great with this work, and I have following on for some pages validating the pages. We are approaching the time when we can start to transclude the work into the main namespace.  From the pages that I have checked, I do not see reasonable logical breaks in the work, and I wondered what are your opinions as you are better acquainted with it. — billinghurst  sDrewth  04:37, 28 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Oh, I see.  There should not be any breaks when transcribing the pages.  The only opinion I have for creating the breakage is: I find the work more enjoyable (like an educated puzzle)  when transcribing the pages out of order as opposed to chronologically.  This is my first assignment, so I have not managed the fundamentals of transcribing volume of pages sequentially while seated in front a computer for a few hours.   But, I understand your feedback, especially when it is time to start transcluding the work into the main namespace.  I will avoid it.Mariewalton (talk) 05:25, 28 September 2012 (UTC)


 * I have reviewed page Help:Transclusion,and I believe I can answer your question more thoroughly.   I now understand that you can transclude proofread pages by portions, single-pages, as well as a whole.  As a result, I should avoid transcribing pages out of sequence.  Now, that the INDEX=Complete Confectioner Glasse 1800 is complete, I intend to transclude the pages as a whole. I will used the pages tag method.   The pattern for transcluding is pages index=“Complete Confectioner Glasse 1800.djuv”from=1 to=398 If this pattern is correct, then I will follow the steps for transclusion.  But, I believe I have to wait until all the pages have been validated prior to transcluding. That is also why it is illogical to create breaks in the work. Thanks. --Mariewalton (talk) 01:20, 1 October 2012 (UTC)

You don't need to wait for validation prior to transclusion, provided the pages being transcluded are in a good proofread condition with bold, italic, &c. in place. I would suggest that transcluding the whole book into one mainspace page will make it too big for practical on-screen use or on an e-Reader. You could transclude it in sections that equate to the headings in the Contents. So, the first section would be The Complete Confectioner/Sugars and the second The Complete Confectioner/Preserves. Then we can put links to these into the Contents and just transclude the prelimary pages to the root page for the work. Beeswaxcandle (talk) 06:56, 1 October 2012 (UTC)

Reply:The mysterious Header toggle button

 * Similar to my comments above, we don't usually need to control the margins in the Page namespace, as these are managed in the Main namespace. Beeswaxcandle (talk) 00:15, 23 September 2012 (UTC)

Terminating right hand word
Gday. In the ye olde works, they added the terminating word at the end on the right of the page, for what is the starting word of the next page. For when we are reproducing the work, the terminating word is now superfluous for our needs, so we would add it to the footer of the page where we are reproducing it. //en.wikisource.org/w/index.php?title=Page%3ACompleteconfectioner_Glasse_1800.djvu%2F43&diff=4072921&oldid=4072813 this edit — billinghurst  sDrewth  06:40, 23 September 2012 (UTC)

Running headers
It looks as thought you're still learning how the running headers work. See how I've modified what you already did at Page:Completeconfectioner Glasse 1800.djvu/106. When you use a running header, there are three "slots" to fill in. The first one you enter is for text aligned to the top left of the page, the second is for centered text, and the third slot is for right-aligned text. If you leave a slot empty, then it won't display anything at that point. So, on the page I mentioned, we ned to have the centered text, and a page number at top right, but nothing in the top left. So, the header is:. The double "pipe" (||) is the result of leaving that first slot empty; there is no text between those pipes, so no text is displayed at top left. You'll also notice that, as a result of doing it this way, you won't have to specify "right=" for items in the top right. It will happen automatically by filling in the third slot. --EncycloPetey (talk) 04:08, 25 September 2012 (UTC)

„”== Reply:Running Headers ==

Thanks, I have looked it over, and will use the appropriate format.


 * I think you have been told something wrong but not on purpose. In looking at the page and advice above, it does appear that the book has italics for the pages but looking at more pages shows that it does not use any italics in the running headers on the page numbers. I have looked further than one page and I see no italics i.e. http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Page:Completeconfectioner_Glasse_1800.djvu/113 Others will make any corrections *if they are really needed to be corrected.* Meanwhile, you do very good work. Kindest regards, &mdash; William Maury Morris II  Talk 08:51, 30 September 2012 (UTC)


 * On second thought, since I have seen that you have gone so far, I do not think the page numbers in italics will matter and more so since you have them all in italics. Godspeed, &mdash; William Maury Morris II  Talk 08:55, 30 September 2012 (UTC)

United States Report Volume 1:Transclusion
I am considering transcluding Index:United States Report Volume 1 according to each cases. If you take a look at the Index page,[],each case is listed on the right side of the page, which indicates how the pages should be transcluded. On the other hand, if I transclude the pages based on the cases' year such as 1754-64,as well as the number of pages per transclusion (not to exceed 20 pages), it may also work. Yet, combining the individual pages, the pages' layout may not appear chronologically. Some pages' margin will be set differently than its counterpart. Which transclusion do you prefer? By the way, how can I control the margin of each page? I tried using the same left and right width for each page, but I received a different look for each page, still? Any suggestions? Thanks.--Mariewalton (talk) 05:05, 13 October 2012 (UTC)


 * Regarding setting a margin layout for each page, I no longer need assistance. To which trancluding style that you prefer for the Index:United States Report Volume I, I need a suggestion. Thanks.--Mariewalton (talk) 16:57, 13 October 2012 (UTC)


 * I've asked George Orwell III, who is one of our main contributors in the US Legal area. He says that he's a bit busy over the next few days (and wants to think through the various options), but he'll come back to us. In the meantime feel free to go ahead and transclude them as individual cases. To do that you're going to need to use sections. Have a look at Help:Transclusion for guidance on this. If you'd like me to do the first couple for you let me know. Beeswaxcandle (talk) 23:35, 13 October 2012 (UTC)


 * I need help with transcluding this Volume, after-all. Can you begin with djuv/12?  Thanks!--Mariewalton (talk) 00:15, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

Good-day,Thanks for offering your assistance. I figure out how to transclude each page as it is listed in the Table of Contents. I could not get a single page to be trancluded without an error message appearing in the template. But, I have tried the from/to section parameter then the whole page appeared in the template. Finally, I tried the onlysection parameter, it worked! Now, I have to return to each proofread page to add the onlysection parameter. Ah, I now understand the importance in adding parameters in a specific type of work as this index. Sincere.--Mariewalton (talk) 01:48, 27 November 2012 (UTC)

Re: Popular Science Monthly Volume 3
We, who are about to proofread more of PSM, salute you! Thanks for your great contribution of validating Vol. 3 of PSM.— Ineuw talk 03:39, 22 November 2012 (UTC)
 * You are certainly welcome!--Mariewalton (talk) 04:03, 22 November 2012 (UTC)

American History Told by Contemporaries, v2.djvu
Can you explain how to change the volume from Index:Not-Proofread to Index:Proofread?

Thus far, I have created a pagelist in order to check the file. Then, I attempted to create a new page with heading Index:American History Told by Contemporaries, V2. diju but was returned to the page's original not-proofread status. Concerning the Table of Contents, I adhered to instructions but am assuming the content will be listed as soon as those pages are transcluded; thereby, the table of content will be listed on the left side correctly. Thanks.--Mariewalton (talk) 10:18, 27 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Hey Marie,


 * I looked over the index, and it appears that so far you've done everything correctly. The pages are numbered properly, so the status is promoted from "Pagelist needed" to "To be proofread." It will remain in this status until all of the pages have been proofread, then it will be promoted to "To be validated."


 * Regarding the Contents pages, once those have been proofread and saved, they will appear on the Wikisource Index: page. I did this one, which I've proofread (which you can validate after you check it over for any misspellings).


 * As I was typing this up I realized the page I proofed wasn't showing up either... all the file name needed was a ", v2.djvu"; I think that solves it :) - Theornamentalist (talk) 15:44, 27 May 2013 (UTC)


 * The change of category comes with the change in the drop down box, it is integrated into that field. — billinghurst  sDrewth  16:11, 27 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the help. I can start transcribing!--Mariewalton (talk) 07:07, 28 May 2013 (UTC)

The Popular Science Monthly project
Hi, and many thanks for your efforts at validating the pages of the PSM project. No doubt that I miss some things because whenever returning to my previously proofread pages, I do find oversights. Thus, I’ve been meaning to ask for your comments about what I miss so that I may improve my efforts. I tend to work in a certain order, but this may not always seems obvious to others. Also, if you would like to proofread (instead of just validating) and wish for some insight or info on the PSM layout please feel free contact me.— Ineuw talk 19:16, 27 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi Ineuw,

Thanks for the invitation. As for any oversights, now and then I may add a missing italic or some other punctuation. Overall, the editing done by you, other editors and volunteers are flawless. The tables are especially well-done. I have yet to master them but am learning a variety of techniques, and have included the "how to do" in my cheat-sheet. However, I have noticed a difference in transcluding pages. The technique observed in PSM appears less a challenge and easier to manage than what I have used in previous works. For example, I have not applied section-end at the closing of a new section/chapter whereas it is applied in PSM.

Regarding your work’s order, I also noticed a consistent routine in which I have no intention to interfere. Validating PSM’s pages works out best but I would not mind contributing toward the easier pages. Creating tables and adding images probably be best if I left that technique up to the experts. But I will give the harder pages a try as soon as I am more comfortable with PSM layout. How can I get more familiar with PSM layout? What will your routine be like for the upcoming volumes? Maybe I can attempt to edit a few of the easier and harder pages at your convenience? Would you send me a date when you feel is best, and I will give it a try?--Mariewalton (talk) 02:07, 28 July 2013 (UTC)


 * A good approach to proofreading is selecting a topic of your interest. The best place to start would be the WikiProject Popular Science Monthly/Categories since all articles until volume 69 have been transcluded and categorized, and I plan to complete the process by this year's end. Another method is to focus on the years of publication — from the 1890’s (volumes in the 40’s and later). You will find that the language, content, and the scan quality improve in later years and contain less typographic enhancements.


 * At the beginning I wrote a proofreading guide, but it’s become obsolete because it was based on my knowledge as a beginner. As time passed, the rules evolved as my knowledge increased, and then some time ago, with the great help of User:Mpaa we standardized the layout from the beginning to end. I am still toying with the idea of a re-write but the task is daunting. Just rest assured that there is a consistency and a method to our madness.


 * All volumes follow the same pattern, with minor changes to accommodate the stylistic evolution of the original. These affect minor article title styles which have already been defined with templates for the whole project. Content styles are consistent from the beginning to end.


 * Whenever you wish, I will gladly provide help in inserting images and table design. All images from Volumes 1 to 87 have already been uploaded to the commons and are organized in per volume categories and in .djvu number order. Every PSM Index: page has links to all of the galleries.


 * Pages with tables are tagged with the PSMTable template which is categorized as Category:PSMTexts needing Maintenance. Of course, my offer of help applies to all aspects of proofreading.— Ineuw talk 15:39, 28 July 2013 (UTC)

Re: PSM Volume 50
Hi. Please don't consider my following your work in Volume 50 and making minor changes as "policing" or interference. It's done only because I didn't have the time to document the stylistic changes of the original volumes and the standardizations that were implemented in midstream after a thorough review with User:Mpaa's invaluable input. Seeing what you do, refreshes my memory and I've been keeping notes to re-write my PSM proofreading guide. One reluctance is the time it would take me from proofreading. You're doing great work and I am very grateful for your help. — Ineuw talk 06:16, 23 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi. Thanks for the note. Am glad to be part of this project, in which I will continue contributing as much as I can like any citizen archivist. Also, I do not consider your following as any sign of interference. If any,  your corrections permit learning additional techniques in order to prevent errors.  Any changes made, I have jotted them down into my Wiki-cheat sheet. --Mariewalton (talk) 08:02, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

PSM vol 50: About the Source
Hi Ineuw.

While transcribing pages 594-596 of Vol 50, I stumbled upon a passage thus acquiring this question to be asked. Are you familiar with the writings of C.F. Hodge? Would you expect writers of the early twentieth century to tie works of mid and late 19th century, such as linking the study of physiology with the study of history? Hence-Carl L. Becker and C.F. Hodge. Sorry if this question is not related to task of editing but had to ask for my own insanity. Hence-student of history. Thanks. --Mariewalton (talk) 14:29, 6 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Hi, and thanks for your concern. It's perfectly OK to include everyone and you will find numerous early 20th century scientists who began publishing in the 1880's. Overall, PSM academic content ends in 1915 (with Volume 87) and there are still numerous references to the works of 19th century academics. FYI, my own interest in the project ends at that volume because of the above stated reason, as well as because I consider the outbreak of WWI critical in the changing direction that science was forced to take because of the war.— Ineuw talk 16:35, 6 September 2013 (UTC)

Placement of various codes in text
Thanks again for your contributions to the PSM project. Forgive me, but I should provide some minor PSM related format info, as well as some important general formatting info.


 * The double rule paragraph separators are 65% of the page width, and not 12em. You may have used some earlier code which I didn't get around to correcting yet. Also they are always preceded and followed by Dhr because rules have no line height like text lines.


 * The fs90/e template terminating a block of text must be applied at the end of the main text area — before the nop It's placed in the footer only when the text on the following page continues to be reduced font size as well. Then, the end code is placed in the footer and the begin code of the following page is placed in the header — allowing for seamless continuity of the text in the main namespace. In essence, when placed in the footer at the end of an article, this has no terminating effect and may have some unintended consequences.


 * The nop page termination code must be the last code of the page in the main text area and on its own line. Anything following this would be applied to the following page. One can test this by adding something after the code and then checking the result in the main namespace transclusion.— Ineuw talk 08:03, 21 October 2013 (UTC)


 * Hi. Thanks for providing PSM format info and general formatting info.

You have been voted in
You are hereby voted into the PSM Hall of Fame as the first (all time) greatest proofreader. My sincere thanks for your help.— Ineuw talk 04:55, 22 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi. Thanks for the vote. --Mariewalton (talk) 20:04, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

Modify User Talk Page
Hi Ineuw,

Am interested in modifying user page and user talk page; specifically combining the two. Another modification includes bookmarking the content to list each topic as a bulletin point. In addition, I would like to bookmark projects that I contributed in the past, including your project if it is permissible. Where can I find tools to improve the layout of my user page while adhering to standards of Wikisource? Thanks.--Mariewalton (talk) 20:37, 25 January 2014 (UTC)