U. S. Senate Speeches and Remarks of Carl Schurz/Duties on Books and Art

Mr. SUMNER. When the article of books was under consideration I asked leave to offer an amendment to it, but the chairman of the committee was indisposed to accept it. I now offer an amendment, to come in on page 54, at the end of line fifty-eight of section forty-eight, &ldquo;and books in foreign and dead languages, of which no editions are printed in the United States;&rdquo; so that the clause will read:

I think there can be no objection to that.

Mr. SHERMAN. As I understand, this would only include Latin and Greek books.

Mr. SUMNER. And French and German also.

Mr. SHERMAN. French and German are living languages; but as I understood the amendment it speaks of &ldquo;dead languages.&rdquo;

Mr. SUMNER. &ldquo;Foreign and dead languages.&rdquo; My idea is to bring in books that are not in competition with any printed works of our own country.

Mr. SHERMAN. I was disposed to indulge the Senator in bringing in, free, books in the dead languages; but as the amendment embraces all living languages, and as so many of our people read French, &amp;c., to their detriment, perhaps we had better not encourage them any further in that direction.

Mr. SUMNER. And German also. We have a large German population here, and we should allow them to receive their German books.

Mr. SHERMAN. I thought at first the amendment was confined to the dead languages, and therefore did not object to it.

Mr. CONKLING. Let the amendment be read again.

The Chief Clerk read the amendment.

Mr. SUMNER. You will observe that the language is &ldquo;of which no editions are printed in the United States.&rdquo; Therefore it contemplates no competition. There can be no competition under that clause. But it will admit books in any foreign or dead language which any person may wish to import. If a person wishes to import such a book why should he be compelled to pay a tax upon it?

Mr. SHERMAN. I wish to ask my friend if this would not be in violation of our treaty obligations? What right have we to discriminate against books published in the English language?

Mr. SUMNER. I beg the Senator's pardon. No question of that kind arises.

Mr. SHERMAN. I submit to my honorable friend that it might raise a question of good faith under our treaties.

Mr. SUMNER. The Senator is very pleasant in putting that question; but he does not intend it as an argument.

Mr. THURMAN. I ask to have the amendment reported again.

The Chief Clerk again read the amendment.

Mr. THURMAN. I think it ought to read &ldquo;foreign or dead languages,&rdquo; not &ldquo;foreign and dead languages.&rdquo;

Mr. CONKLING. A good many things are

foreign that are not dead, and some things are dead that are not foreign.

Mr. SUMNER. It should be &ldquo;foreign or dead.&rdquo;

The VICE PRESIDENT. The amendment will be so modified.

Mr. CONKLING. I desire to say one word. Let it be understood, to borrow somebody's expression, that this is a proposition to except from impost all the flash novels that are published in France, and all the books, good, bad, and indifferent, uttered in any tongue except English. I do not know but that this is something for the benefit of knowledge and adverse to a tax on knowledge. If the Senate are disposed to vote in favor of a proposition which seems to me so monstrous, let them so vote; but let us understand what we do before we vote.

Mr. THURMAN. Does my friend from New York propose a discriminating duty, if we are to have a duty on books, according to their contents, and to have a hundred per cent. or a prohibitory duty on flash novels, and a lower duty on some other kind of literature, and so on down?

Mr. CONKLING. No, Mr. President, I do not wish to deprive my friend and his party associates of the use of French novels, any more than I should of some other things which enter so largely into the constitution of that party. [Laughter.]

Mr. THURMAN. If the gentleman thinks that that is the kind of reading we have, I can retort on him that it would be a great deal better to read French novels than to read the poor, miserable, yellow-covered literature in New York, which is a miserable dilution of the French novels. [Laughter.]

Mr. CONKLING. I am very glad the Senator knows so well about that literature in New York; I do not.

Mr. SCHURZ. I do not think that the bulk of the books printed in foreign languages and imported into this country consist of flash novels by any means.

Mr. CONKLING. Did the Senator understand me to intimate that?

Mr. SCHURZ. No doubt there may be some of them imported also.

Mr. CONKLING. But the question is, whether the Senator, as he imputes to me, understood me to say any such thing?

Mr. SCHURZ. There are so many good books imported that I do not think it is an argument against the free importation of those good books, that alongside of them some bad books may be imported. I believe that a very large quantity, for instance, as far as German literature is concerned, of German school books and very useful books are imported here which contribute to the general education of the people.

Mr. CONKLING. Are not German school books made here also, I inquire of the Senator?

Mr. SCHURZ. There are some of them made here, but a great many imported.

Mr. CONKLING. Is there any school book printed in German that may not be reproduced and reprinted here just as well as any other printing, and much easier, because they are cheaper in the material of which they are made?

Mr. SCHURZ. But I do not refer to school books alone. The best works of German literature are now being reproduced in Germany in very cheap editions, and they ought to be introduced here free of duty. Why should they not be?

Mr. SHERMAN. I ask my honorable friend whether this would not be a direct encouragement to the reading and study of German in this country, where the English language prevails? There are in the city of Cincinnati probably eighty thousand Germans, and they have many of the most flourishing schools there, and I do not see why their children at those schools should have this privilege over others.

Mr. SCHURZ. Does the Senator think it would hurt any American to study German?

Mr. SHERMAN. Oh, no; I believe the contrary; but I think it would be a great deal better for the Germans coming here to learn English.

Mr. SCHURZ. They do.

Mr. SHERMAN. The continuation of German books as a general rule would tend to prevent the children of German parents in this country from learning the English language.

Mr. SCHURZ. I think the Senator is very much mistaken. Wherever German parents have an opportunity to send their children to English schools they almost always do so; and if the Senator will look at the public schools in Cincinnati he will find that in most, if not all of them, the English language is taught alongside of the German, or rather the German is taught alongside of the English. I know it is so in St. Louis. Is not that a good thing?

Mr. MORTON. I should like to make one suggestion to my friend from Missouri. While I am in favor of making the importation of foreign books that we do not print, where there can be no competition with our own manufactures, free, yet in regard to school books I think there is a great propriety in having all the school books for our children prepared in our own country.

Mr. SCHURZ. But suppose you do not have them?

Mr. MORTON. I think the German school books ought to be prepared here.

Mr. SCHURZ. The Senator says they ought to be prepared here; but they are not, and I do not think they will be. There is one remark which I would address to the Senator from Ohio, and that is, that I consider the study of foreign languages an extremely useful thing, especially in a country like this. There is nothing that I can think of in that line that would be more promotive of general intelligence and education than just that; and whatever we can do to promote it will be for the benefit of the people at large. I hope the amendment will be agreed to.

Mr. SUMNER. Senators seem to argue that this is applicable exclusively, or almost exclusively, to school books; but we are all aware that outside of school books there are works of literature, of instruction generally, of travels, of romance if you please, interesting in families, and which thousands who are familiar, for instance, with the German language, would be glad to have. For example, here is the large German population of our country &mdash; is it not right that they should have the means of adding to those innocent recreations that are found in reading? We should be doing a real service to them if we enable them to import books that they lack, cheap &mdash; not merely school books, but I mean the large class of books outside of school books. I see no possible objection to this provision, while I see much in its favor.

I have alluded to the large German population. There is also a very considerable Italian population. Some one told me the other day, who professed to know, that there are three hundred thousand Italians in our country. That seemed to me very large; but it was an estimate made by an Italian. Now, should not those Italians be enabled under our tariff law to import books from their own country, of literature or of science, without paying a tax? It seems to me that we owe that gratification to them when they come here to join their fortunes to ours. And so you may go through the whole list of European nations. Take Spaniards; take Swedes; take Danes. I know not why their books should be taxed when they come to them from across the sea. It seems to me that the tax is inhospitable; it is churlish; and of course it is a tax on knowledge.

Mr. FOWLER. I have but a word to say on this subject. I hope the amendment will prevail. There are not many books that will

come in free under the amendment. Take, for instance, the subject of botany. We could not get a reputable work on the subject of botany in the English language. We have to go to the German language to get it. No scientific man could be provided with a book on that subject if it is heavily taxed. Then, again, in reference to our school books, so far as valuable improvements have been made in them, they have been taken almost exclusively from the German rather than from the English. Why should there be any objection to our getting German books for our German schools free? In almost all the public schools in our large cities the German language is taught, as well as other modern European languages. Unless we can get a good supply of those books from Europe we shall be at a loss, because we cannot find them here. There is no danger of any great amount of injustice being done to the revenue under this amendment.

Not only are we destitute of fine works on botany, but there are other sciences in which we are almost entirely dependent upon the German and the French &mdash; chemistry, geology, and mineralogy particularly. Those works ought to be imported free. Then, again, important discoveries have recently been made in astronomy and mathematics. We are very anxious to keep up with those discoveries, and to do so we must have a supply of the best books from abroad. Scientific men have great difficulty in getting them, and they are the ones who are taxed by this duty on books, and taxed severely, although they use those books for the purpose of distributing information among the people.

Mr. SHERMAN. I wish to enter a motion for a recess from half past four o'clock until half past seven o'clock.

Mr. SUMNER. I will ask, is that desirable? We were here last night, and expect to be here to-morrow night.

Mr. SHERMAN. It seems to me the business of the country demands it. I suffer as much from a night session as any one, but I think it necessary.

Mr. SUMNER. I think we had better sit until five o'clock, and then adjourn until to-morrow.

Mr. SHERMAN. We waste so much time on these little matters that it is necessary to have a recess and an evening session.

Mr. SUMNER. The Senator will have to-morrow for his bill.

Mr. SHERMAN. I know that; but I wish to get this bill through if possible by to-morrow at four o'clock. I give fair notice of that.

Mr. FOWLER. But when the chairman of the Committee on Finance gets through with his bill he rests.

Mr. SHERMAN. I could not get along unless I did.

The PRESIDENT OFFICER, (Mr. in the chair.) The Senator from Ohio moves that at half past four o'clock to-day the Senate take a recess until half past seven o'clock.

The motion was agreed to &mdash; ayes twenty-eight, noes not counted.

The PRESIDENT OFFICER. The question recurs on the amendment of the Senator from Massachusetts, [Mr. .]

Mr. WILLIAMS. I should think it will be difficult for a collector of customs to determine, when an invoice of books is brought into the country, whether or not editions of those works were published in the United States; and I do not see how he could ascertain that fact.

Mr. SHERMAN. And what language they are in also.

Mr. WILLIAMS. Yes, and what language they are in. I object to this amendment, because it is a discrimination, according to the argument of the Senator from Massachusetts, against our own people. Italians, he says, ought to be allowed to import their books free of duty, and Germans ought to be allowed to import their books free of duty. Then why

should not English and Americans be allowed to import their books free of duty?

Mr. SUMNER. Because they would come in competition with the manufacture of books here in our own country.

Mr. WILLIAMS. I am very confident that books are published in the United States in various foreign languages, and that it is a business that will grow up and be an extensive business in this country, and eventually will accommodate more people than will be accommodated if the Germans and Italians and other foreign-born citizens of this country are compelled to depend upon importations for their supply. I think it is better to let the law stand as it is.

The VICE PRESIDENT. The question is on agreeing to the amendment offered by the Senator from Massachusetts.

The amendment was rejected.

Mr. SUMNER. I offer another amendment, to insert on page 104, at the end of line fifty-eight of section forty-eight, &ldquo;also books with illustrations relating to the sciences and the arts.&rdquo;

On that I wish to read a remark of an intelligent person not belonging to the class that the Senator from Ohio characterized as rich men who import books, but one who imports books because he needs them. Remarking on the works of science and the arts, including books on architecture and the fine arts, which now pay very heavily at the custom-house, he says:

Now, I put it to Senators whether any injurious consequence can result from allowing these books to come in free. The duty that you receive from them is small; it is very little for you to give up; but in giving facilities to the importation of such books you contribute to knowledge. I am sure of it. I have no motive in making this motion, or this succession of motions, except my anxiety for the extension of knowledge in this Republic. I am for free schools; I am for free knowledge everywhere; and I wish to beat down all the obstructions possible, and one of those is the tax which we impose in our tariff. I hope there can be no question on that amendment.

The VICE PRESIDENT. The question is on agreeing to the amendment of the Senator from Massachusetts.

The question being put, there were &mdash; ayes eleven.

Mr. SUMNER. I ask for the yeas and nays on that amendment.

The yeas and nays were ordered; and being taken, resulted &mdash; yeas 14, nays 26; as follows:

So the amendment was rejected.

Mr. SCHURZ. On page 107, line one hundred and forty-two of section forty eight, after the word &ldquo;artist,&rdquo; I move to insert these words:

Mr. WILSON. I will ask the Senator from Missouri why he does not make his amendment prospective?

Mr. SCHURZ. The bill itself provides for them hereafter.

Mr. CAMERON. I move to amend the amendment by striking out the words &ldquo;and property;&rdquo; so that anybody abroad may buy the productions of American artists and bring them into this country free.

Mr. WILLIAMS. The bill provides for that.

Mr. SHERMAN. I think this matter is already covered by the clause in the bill; but if there is any doubt about it, by striking out the proviso in the bill it will meet the very point stated by the Senator from Missouri. I will read the clause. It is in the free list:

This is in connection with the last section of the bill which allows any of these paintings, statuary, fountains, and other works of art, after this act takes effect, to have the benefit of the free list. Then, if the Senator will strike out the proviso ---

Mr. SCHURZ. What proviso?

Mr. SHERMAN. The proviso beginning in line one hundred and thirty-nine, reading as follows:

Mr. SCHURZ. I will say to the Senator from Ohio that that is exactly the case I want to meet.

Mr. SHERMAN. Why not, then, strike out this proviso?

Mr. SCHURZ. I am perfectly satisfied with that.

Mr. WILLIAMS. I do not think that would answer. How is the fact that it is the production of an American artist to be verified?

Mr. SHERMAN. By proof.

Mr. WILLIAMS. But this requires what the proof shall be.

Mr. SHERMAN. I know, but it requires a particular form of proof; that is, the certificate of the consul or minister of the United States. However, this is not material.

Mr. SCHURZ. I cannot see any objection particularly to the amendment.

The VICE PRESIDENT. The pending question is on the amendment to the amendment offered by the Senator from Pennsylvania.

Mr. SCHURZ. I will state to the Senator from Oregon what kind of cases I want to cover. I know of one case at least, of an artist who painted a picture in this country, took it to Europe and placed it on exhibition there, and then imported it back to this country without first procuring the certificate of a consul or minister as to his having made that picture and being the proprietor of it, and the picture is now in the custom-house; and as the old law provided that an artist might import free of duty a picture which he had made abroad, but not a picture which he had made here in the United States and taken abroad, the picture is held in the United States custom-house.

Mr. SHERMAN. The tariff law has always been that anything of American production exported abroad and returned back in the same condition is admitted duty free. There must be some misapprehension about that case.

Mr. SCHURZ. I beg the Senator's pardon. I myself applied at the Treasury Department to have that picture admitted duty free, and it was stated to me that the law covered all pictures that were made abroad by American artists; but not pictures that were made in this country by an American and then taken abroad for the purpose of exhibiting them, to be brought back to the United States.

Mr. SHERMAN. The difficulty in that case must be owing to some defect of proof. I think the Senator will find, on a close examination of that case, that the artist has not furnished the requisite proof of the facts. Probably the law requires a consular certificate. That is the general law.

Mr. SCHURZ. The case I have in view is a case of notoriety, especially in the family of the Senator from Ohio, for the artist I refer to is the same who made one of the best pictures of General Sherman that I ever saw. I really to not see that there can be any objection to the amendment.

Mr. CAMERON. The object of my motion, as I stated a minute ago, is to give our own native artists all the benefit from the culture, which they can receive abroad much better than here, and I desire to give facilities for extending the works of American artists by Americans who are abroad, and therefore I offer the amendment. The artists have the right to bring them back here by the present laws, I believe. But if you give the right to every one who may purchase the works of American artists to bring them in free I think you will confer a great benefit upon our own artists. I can see no objection to it at all. My proposition is plain and distinct, and I hope it will be adopted.

Mr. MORRILL, of Vermont. By the existing law paintings and statuary, the production of American artists abroad, can be imported into the United States free, and all that is necessary is to have a certificate from the artist or a consul. It seems to me the present law is broad enough; but this new law provides that fountains and other works of art, the production of American artists, shall be admitted free. If this should be included, I think the only amendment we ought to adopt here would be to alter the last part of the clause in the bill so as to require the fact to be verified by the certificate of any consul, or minister, or the artist.

Mr. WILLIAMS. I see no objection to the amendment proposed by the Senator from Missouri. It simply applies to pictures now in the custom-house that have been brought over and remain there upon which duty is claimed. The law itself here provides for all future cases, and it is altogether within the spirit of the law, and if there be any cases as described in that amendment where American artists have brought their pictures or statuary back to the United States and they are detained in the custom-house and charged with duty it seems to me they ought to be delivered to the artist who has made them and whose property they are without any duty. I think the amendment ought to be adopted.

The VICE PRESIDENT. The question is on the amendment to the amendment offered by the Senator from Pennsylvania.

The amendment to the amendment was agreed to.

The VICE PRESIDENT. The question recurs on the amendment as amended.

The amendment, as amended, was agreed to.