Slee v. Erhard, Deposition of Margaret T. Singer, Ph.D.

ALFRIEDA SLEE, ADM: OF THE ESTATE OF JACK SLEE, Plaintiffs, Vs. WERNER ERHARD, et al. ,Defendants.

Civil Action No. N-84-497-JAC

DEPOSITION OF MARGARET T. SINGER, Ph.D. VOL. II Taken before KAREN ALDERSON, a Certified Shorthand Reporter, License No. C-6279 and A Notary Public in and for the County of Contra Costa, State of California

July 22, 1987

Q.	Would you please list all the times that you've spoken for or on behalf or at the request the Spiritual Counterfeits, Project?

A.       I remember another occasion sometime back where I was asked to talk to the group about cults and have no rememberance of when it was.

Q.	None at all?

A.	No, Sir.

Q.	Okay.

A.	Several years back.

Q.      So except for those two times, have you ever been invited to speak or did you ever speak for the Spiritual	 Counterfeit Project?

A.       Yes, I remember a third time. They had a program in a church in Berkeley, and I was on that Program.

Q.	  Okay, those are the three times that you've been on programs for the Spiritual Counterfeits Project?

A.	That's all I can think of.

Q.	When you spoke on any of those occasions, did you speak about therapy cults or psychotherapy cults?

A.	No.

Q.	What did you speak about?

A.	The first time was about cults, the second speech was on psychopaths, and the third speech was on how to deal with threatening and menacing people in the office.

Q. Now have you made a distinction between the word-"cults" and the word "psychotherapy cults" or "therapy cults"?

A. Yes.

Q. Well, I know you have said previously that there are many different kinds of cults, but would you say that a psychotherapy cult is not a cult?

A.	No, sir.

Q.	So a psychotherapy cult would be a cult?

A.	It is a division of the generic term "cult."

Q.	So something which you say is a psychotherapy cult you would also say is a cult, is that correct?

A.	Yes.

Q.	You did not speak about cults on the three occasions that you spoke at the Spiritual Counterfeit Project?

A.  I already testified that my first talk was on cults.

Q.	I apologize, you did say that.

A.	Uh-huh.

Q.	Were you the only speaker in the first program that you have identified or were there other speakers?

A.	There were other speakers.

Q.	Do you know if a transcription was made of any of the three speeches you gave or addresses you gave at the Spiritual Counterfeit Project?

A.	I don't believe so.

Q.	At any one of those three occasions, were you asked or did you offer that est, the est training, the est organization, or any programs of est, was a cult or a therapy or a psychotherapy cult? A.	No. Q.	Dr. Singer, have you ever been asked to address the Cult Awareness Network, formerly the Citizens Freedom Foundation? Okay, that's a question. A.	Yes. Q.	And did you? A.	Yes.

Q. How many times? A.	At the moment I can think of three times.

Q. And were you on the program alone or were you on with other people? A.	Other people. Q.	Have you ever made a presentation with Dr. Richard Offshee? A.	Yes. Q.	Was that a Cult Awareness Network event or a Spiritual Counterfeits Project event? A.	Yes. Q.	Which one, or both? A.	Only a Cult Awareness or Citizens Freedom Foundation meeting where we both were on the same program. Q.	Do you know if transcriptions were made of any of the lectures or speeches you gave at the Cult Awareness Network or Citizens Freedom Foundation? A.	I don't know. Q.	Did you ever tell anybody you did? A.	No sir. Q.	Deprograming involves kidnapping, does it not? A.	No, sir. Q.	Never? A.	Well, it has. Q.	But that's nothing that you ever participated in or nothing you ever knew about? A.	I read the paper so I've known, but I've never participated in such. Q.	Fine. Now I asked you questions about a man named Hiam Crown and a woman named Miriam Tessa Glazer. Did I ask you any questions about the Committee on Cult Affairs in Israel? Do you have any connection with them or contact with them, communication from them or to them? A.	No, sir, just that. Q.	Only the request from Hiam Crown which you never responded to? A.	Which I never responded to. Q.	If Hiam Crown would have asked you if the est training or est organization was a cult of any sort, you would have said no, is that correct? A.	That's right. Q.	Sorry? A.	That's right. Q.	Okay. A.	It is not my opinion that it is a cult