Page:MALAYSIA BILL RHODESIA AND NYASALAND BILL (2) (Hansard, 11 Juli 1963).djvu/27

 if when winding up the debate the Attorney-General would give specific assurances that no secret or private undertakings of any sort entered into this matter.

Our view on this side of the attitude of the Government to the question of Southern Rhodesia's demands for independence is simple. It is that there should be no independence without self-determination for the people of Southern Rhodesia. I use the term"self-determination" rather than"democracy" advisedly, because I think it is the proper and more accurate description of what is an essential condition. The forms of democracy in the newer African countries inevitably differ greatly from our Westminster kind of democracy though they do not differ so greatly from the kind of régime that existed under the colonial system or under a white minority rule.

Mr. Wall I agree with the hon. Gentleman. But I think he would also agree that the white people will not live in that sort of democracy. They are used to our form and not the new form which would be acceptable to the Africans.

Mr. Thomson This is the final point to which I wish to apply myself as frankly and, I hope, as fairly as I can.

I think that the essential condition which I would lay down in Southern Rhodesia for independence would be that before any granting of independence it should, in fact, have a Government enjoying the representative consent of the majority of the population. I think that more important than"one man, one vote" by itself. I understand the difficulties of the First Secretary about this. Mr. Stanley Baldwin once gave a description of the prerogative of a harlot as power without responsibility. Over Southern Rhodesia it sometimes seems to me that the First Secretary is in exactly the opposite position as Miss Christine Keeler in that he enjoys a great deal of responsibility and almost no power. But with this Bill I hope the right hon. Gentleman understands that his power in Southern Rhodesia is, in fact, increasing, because just as Southern Rhodesia enjoyed the greatest share of economic benefits under Federation so it bears the heaviest part of the economic burden of the dissolution and the decline of confidence that has preceded it.

When this is discussed in the White Paper the point of view of the Government is put in a number of bland words which looks as if they might have been written by the right hon. Gentleman himself. It says: "The question whether the United Kingdom Government could and should help would have to be considered in the light of their general policies on overseas aid towards countries which showed need for assistance in the development of their economies." I believe that we ought to try to give that help to Southern Rhodesia provided that those who rule Southern Rhodesia at the moment are ready to help themselves and to put their Constitution on a more democratic basis. It would surely put the present Government in an even more preposterous position at the United Nations than they are in at the moment if they were to have to tell the Assembly that they claimed no power over Southern Rhodesia's racial policies but that they did accept responsibility for her economic policy.

In many ways I think that Southern Rhodesia is perhaps the final—it is certainly the most difficult—task of colonial statesmanship for this country. That task is to persuade the European minority in Southern Rhodesia that its own interests as well as those of the rest of the world will best be served by conceding democratic institutions. As was said by the hon. Member for Hertford in an extremely powerful and persuasive speech, there are immensely strong and common sense reasons for Southern Rhodesians, looking at their own conditions through their own eyes, to argue that they should not go it alone and engage in unilateral acts of independence. In all parts of the House we all hope that whatever else divides us the possibilities of peaceful political progress in Southern Rhodesia are not yet exhausted. Certainly we hope with all our hearts that the Southern Rhodesians may yet be persuaded to accept the help of this country in walking the way—and it is the only way—of peaceful democratic advance to independence.

Mr. Thorpe May I assume that it would be the wish of the hon. Member for Dundee, East (Mr. G. M. Thomson) not to quote anything out of context which would make a travesty of the facts? Since he referred to it, I shall quote what the late Mr. Clement Davies said on 4th March, 1952. After saying: "I hope the conference will be a success"—" that was referring to the London Conference—he went on to say: "I implore the Government and the Opposition—in fact all of