Page:MALAYSIA BILL RHODESIA AND NYASALAND BILL (1) (Hansard, 11 Juli 1963).djvu/16

 Therefore, whatever may be the difference in political outlook, whatever their jealousies, it is very important for the standard of living of these three countries that economically they should have common services and, I personally hope—though. I do not always like them—a common market. That is what we in this House must try to secure. Let us face the fact that if we do not get those links there will be a very great fall in the standard of living in all those three countries and a very large increase in the numbers in unemployment.

To my mind, this can only be a decision of the three territories themselves. This is where I am going to disagree with the right hon. Gentleman the Member for Middlesbrough, East. I believe that this is also a decision that they must take as independent nations and not when they are under some vestige of colonial control. I do not believe that any decision taken by any of these three countries on this question of collaboration will be lasting unless they are completely independent. If that is so, this is the real test of statesmanship. I believe we have 1457 got to resign our colonial responsibilities before we come to that stage.

I know that the Labour Party and the right hon. Gentleman the Member for Middlesbrough, East—I am surprised because I thought he was a fairly forward-thinking right hon. Gentleman—want to put the clock back. He wants, if he can, to tie one of these countries back to the apron strings of the Colonial Office in Whitehall. I should have thought he would have got enough experience in political life to know—

Mr. Bottomley rose—

Mr. Turton I have not quite finished. I will give the right hon. Member an opportunity—to know that we realty cannot put the clock back. That is reactionary stuff.

He admitted, he said, that rightly or wrongly Parliament had taken away all but the very last vestige of our control over Southern Rhodesia. He is quite right. This has been very nearly the position since 1923. It is now the year of grace 1963, and we cannot go back to the erabefore 1923. That is why I gave him the opportunity to ask what changes he would want the Southern Rhodesian Government to make. Now, thanks a good deal to the boycott by the African Nationalists at the last election, this particular Government in Southern Rhodesia, which overturned the Government of Sir Edgar Whitehead, went into that election on a pledge that they would not alter the franchise. In my judgment, that Government are a Government who will honour their pledges. That is the problem I put to the right hon. Gentleman and that my hon. and gallant Friend put to him when he intervened. His answer was an evasion. In my view the answer was reactionary, and that is where I challenge the right hon. Gentleman.

Mr. Bottomley I am obliged to the right hon. Gentleman for giving way. I think the difference between us is this. Of course I want independence for Southern Rhodesia, but I want independence for all the people of Southern Rhodesia, not to hand power to a few vested interests.

Mr. Turton That is the difficulty. The right hon. Gentleman wants to put the clock back. He has not got the answer. Is he really going to suggest that he will bring in a Bill to take Southern Rhodesia back to the time before the 1923 Constitution? [An HON. MEMBER:"We have it."] If we do not do that—and this is vitally important, in my view, and, as he knows, I have not agreed with every action taken by all the Southern Rhodesian Governments—we have not got power to intervene on such matters. This is, therefore, a responsibility of ours, in the interests of the 8½ million people of Central Africa, to try to encourage the Southern Rhodesians to go in the direction we want without breaking their pledges at the last election.

Let me say quite frankly to him that I should like to see more African members of Parliament in the Southern Rhodesian Parliament. I believe that that is a practicable step to take if it is approached in the right way. But let me warn him. If it is not, then these men in Southern Rhodesia, who are as anxious as he and I are for the well being of the people of all races and colour in Southern Rhodesia, will, I am afraid, be driven into hostility to this country and this Parliament. They believe, as I said at the beginning, that they have been let down by us. I believe that is why at this moment,