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Rh MR. SIMPSON:.

MR. SCHIFF: And would Mr. Katsyv be considered an oligarch?

MR. SIMPSON: No. At least he doesn't have a media profile as an oligarch. And that was the thing that I scanned for when the case came in. You know, are these guys -- can they get visas to the U.S.? Are they considered connected with some Mafia outfit? Do they go to the Kremlin to meet with Putin? And there was none of that.

So, you know, so it seemed okay to me. I wouldn't, you know -- they just didn't have much of a profile. And so I figured if they were big oligarchs, and especially bad oligarchs, that I would have heard of them.

MR. SCHIFF: And were you aware of any connection between Mr. Katsyv and the Russian Government?

MR. SIMPSON: Well, his father was a -- at the time that I was retained, his father was a minister in the Moscow city government. He was the transportation minister. And he is later, he is now the deputy head of the state railroad, state railroad company. And so that's a connection.

MR. SCHIFF: And did the father, to your knowledge, have any connections with Mr. Chaika?

MR. SIMPSON: I have no idea.

MR. SCHIFF: Or did Mr. Katsyv have any connections to Mr. Agalarov?

MR. SIMPSON: Well, what I have heard in recent months is that there is some connection, or maybe even read it, I can't remember, but there is some connection between Agalarov and Ms. Veselnitskaya. And I don't know what it is. I don't even remember where I heard it. UNCLASSIFIED, COMMITTEE SENSITIVE