Page:Debates in the Several State Conventions, v5.djvu/557

1787.] This Constitution, he said, is to be paramount to the state constitutions. It follows, hence, from this article, that two thirds of the states may obtain a convention, a majority of which can bind the Union to innovations that may subvert the state constitutions altogether. He asked whether this was a situation proper to be run into.

Mr. HAMILTON seconded the motion; but, he said, with a different view from Mr. Gerry. He did not object to the consequences slated by Mr. Gerry. There was no greater evil in subjecting the people of the United Slates to the major voice, than the people of a particular state. It had been wished by many, and was much to have been desired, that an easier mode of introducing amendments had been provided by the Articles of the Confederation. It was equally desirable now, that an easy mode should be established for supplying defects which will probably appear in the new system. The mode proposed was not adequate. The state legislatures will not apply for alterations, but with a view to increase their own powers. The national legislature will be the first to perceive, and will be most sensible to, the necessity of amendments; and ought also to be empowered, whenever two thirds of each branch should concur, to call a convention. There could be no danger in giving this power, as the people would finally decide in the case.

Mr. MADISON remarked on the vagueness of the terms, "call a convention for the purpose," as sufficient reason for reconsidering the article. How was a convention to be formed?—by what rule decide?—what the force of its acts?

On the motion of Mr. Gerry, to reconsider,—

Massachusetts, Connecticut, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Maryland, Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, Georgia, ay, 9; New Jersey, no, 1; New Hampshire, divided.

Mr. SHERMAN moved to add to the article,—

"or the legislature may propose amendments to the several states for their approbation; but no amendments shall be binding until consented to by the several states."

Mr. GERRY seconded the motion.

Mr. WILSON moved to insert "two thirds of" before the words "several states;" on which amendment to the motion of Mr. Sherman,—

New Hampshire, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Maryland, Virginia, ay, 5; Massachusetts, Connecticut, New Jersey, North Carolina, South Carolina, Georgia, no, 6.

Mr. WILSON then moved to insert "three fourths of" before "the several states;" which was agreed to, ''nem. con.''

Mr. MADISON moved to postpone the consideration of the amended proposition, in order to take up the following:—

"The legislature of the United States, whenever two thirds of both Houses shall deem necessary, or on the application of two thirds of the legislatures of the several states, shall propose amendments to this Constitution, which shall be valid, to all intents and purposes, as part thereof, when the same shall have been ratified by three fourths, at least, of the legislatures of the several states, or by conventions in three fourths thereof, as one or the other mode of ratification may be proposed by the legislature of the United States."