Page:Debates in the Several State Conventions, v3.djvu/600

584 there not some arguments in support of that plan, sir, that appear to me totally unsatisfactory. With respect to concurrent jurisdiction, sir, the honorable gentleman has observed, that county courts had exercised this right without complaint. Have Hanover and Henrico the same objects? Can an officer in either of those counties serve a process in the other? The federal judiciary has concurrent jurisdiction throughout the states, and therefore must interfere with the state judiciaries. Congress can pass a law constituting the powers of the federal judiciary throughout the states: they may also pass a law vesting the federal power in the state judiciaries. These laws are permanent, and cannot be controverted by any law of the state.

If we were forming a general government, and not states, I think we should perfectly comply with the genius of the paper before you; but if we mean to form one great national government for thirteen states, the arguments which I have heard hitherto in support of this part of the plan do not apply at all. We are willing to give up all powers which are necessary to preserve the peace of the Union, so far as respects foreign nations, or our own preservation; but we will not agree to a federal judiciary, which is not necessary for this purpose, because the powers there granted will tend to oppress the middling and lower class of people. A poor man seized by the federal officers, and carried to the federal court,—has he any chance under such a system as this? Justice itself may be bought too dear; yet this may be the case. It may cost a man five hundred pounds to recover one hundred pounds. These circumstances are too sacred to leave undefined; and I wish to see things certain, positive, and clear. But, however, sir, these matters have been so fully investigated, that I beg pardon for having intruded so far, and I hope we shall go on in the business.

Mr. GEORGE MASON. Mr. Chairman: the latter part of this clause, sir, I confess I do not understand—Full faith and credit shall be given to all acts; and how far it may be proper that Congress shall declare the effects, I cannot clearly see into.

Mr. MADISON. Mr. Chairman, it appears to me that this is a clause which is absolutely necessary. I never heard