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 BULLETIN .OF THE COOPER ORNITHOLOGICAL CLUB. 69 site of the old ones, the new nest be- ing composed of the remnants of the several old ones, with some additions. The raven is very persistent and I have knovn one pair to lay four sets of eggs in one season and would probably have laid a fifth but unfortunately the nest was destroyed. I have occasionally found them nest- ing in the steep banks of deep, narrow gulches, but usually they prefer a large gravel cliff in some secluded part of the hills, and in every instance the nests have been lined with sheep's wool gath- ered from the numerous bands of shee p feeding in the vicinity.. I had intended to paymy respects to the ravens this year but have. been otherwise engaged. However I procured a handsome set of Duck Hawk  from a deserted raven's nest on April 5, 899, and feel that since I cannot help it, that I should al- low my birds a short vacation. FURTHER COMMUNICATIONS ON BIRD PROTECTION. CIRCUMSTANCES ALTER CASES." To 3fy Fellow Collectors.'-- "The science of ornithology demands the coiledting of any reasonable number of birds to further its ends, and personally I have taken the lives of birds with as much zeal as any, when the skins were desired for actual use." I believe that I stand on the same ground as that defined by Mr. Barlow in our last ]]ULLE- TIN. I am also in sympathy with the position, taken by Dr. Coues in his editorial in April Osprey. To put the matter in my own words, I believe in collecting all the scientific speci- mens, birds' skins and eggs included, that we may want to use. I believe iu series and large series.. If, of one species, we can use IOO mam- mals or 300 fish, we had better take them. If specimens are to be compared, if we can learn anything from them, or if we can pass them on to another who is in need of the material, I be- lieve we are justified in collecting in any quan- tity to supply that demand. I do not believe in collecting for the milliner or taking bir4s in nesting timewhen the same plumages may' be had before nesting. I have refrained from shooting many birds because I thought they had nests and I have shot birds when I knew they had eggs or young. "Circumstances alter cases." In the numerous letters which have appeared in 'the last six months concerning "bird slaugh- ter". and "egg hogging", there seem to be about three grounds upon which the various authors condemn collecting. It is wrong to. kill birds and take their eggs because () it is cruel; (2). it is o no use or scie.ntific benefit or (3) it will exterminate the species. If it is cruel to kill wild birds and take their eggs then we had better stop killi. ng.'and robbing the domestic birds. I do not agree with the Rev. Mr. Henninger that "the forcineff a poor Flicker to lay 7x eggs in 73 days" is cruel. How many eggs is apoor barn-yard fowl forced to lay in a year? Is it not cruel to.force her to hatch duck's eggs? It is not commonly so considered. The question of cruelty is one which we cannot consider in his connection as,it is a matter of personal opinion ,and not subject to discussion any more than religious dogmas are. The value of large series of eggs from a sin- gle species is largely a matter of personal opin- ion. For my part I think as much can be learned from 5o eggs of the Red-tailed Hawk as from an egg each of 5o species of birds. In this connection it is hardly worth while to call attention to the indignation of F. H. K. in his review of g;.s of A/alive ?ennsylvania.. Birds, Osprey for November, x898, where he condemns the collecting of more than ? eggs of a species and of oological abnormalitiea al- together. The number of sets of a species which you will take must be regulated by yourself and decided without the help of the protectionist. Everyone learns by collecting a few eggs for himself. There is one class of collectors which should certainly be sup- pressed and they have been well dealt with, in writing, by Mr. Witmet Stone. See luk XVI, P. 55- For the boys who gather eggs as they would pretty shells and the man who strives to possess the largest collection in towu, we have no use. Neither can we consider such articles as the one asking "Hast thou named all the birds without a gun"? We don't do it that way on the Pacific Coast;. The A. O. U, says it doesn't go! In the possible extermination of birds we find the first point which the extreme bird protectionists have made. If we are seriously reducing the bird ranks it is time to call a halt and every sincere ornithologist will obey the command. Let us see what evidence we have