Author talk:Ethel Julia Cablk

=Sources= quick data dump. Shows as a teacher in 1910s in New York in a directory. I haven't check find a grave for a burial. — billinghurst  sDrewth  13:04, 22 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks very much, I always admire your ability to get similar data. I agree that it is most probably the same person, although there are just a few hints that suggest it: 1) quite unusual name 2) Residence in New York 3) Household with Novomesky family. What I lack to make it absolutely certain is anything that would connect her with the linguist education/profession or with social welfare work, as described in, your data just mention the profession of a "dressmaker". Native tongue "English" is probably a beaurocratic mistake.
 * It would also be helpful if her birthplace could be located. From various hints I supposed that she is of Slovak origin and not Hungarian, one of them was a short mention of some Ethel J. Cablková as a member of some American Czecho-Slovak committee. However, the data below are ambiguous. The passport data state "Czechoslovakia", which I read as those parts of Austria-Hungary that later formed Czechoslovakia. The other of the data state Hungary (which could be OK as Slovakia was considered to be a part of Hungary). However, I failed to find out what is meant by "Oresbeng", according to (which also gives data about some Ethel Julia Cablk, but I am not sure if it is the same one) it could be  (German:Ohreslahn). That would make Ethel Cablk a Hungarian, although it would not disprove her Slovak ethnicity,as some Slovaks used to live also in northern parts of Hungary, and English Wikipedia states that there used to be a numerous Slovak population directly in this town. Nevertheless, all of this is just mere speculation, some hard data would be much more useful. --Jan Kameníček (talk) 14:28, 22 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Another point besides the "dressmaker" that raises some doubts whether it is the same person is: Attended School: No. --Jan Kameníček (talk) 15:22, 22 March 2020 (UTC)

The petition for nationalisation has Emil Novomesky as a witness, which ties census and the passport. Things to remember in who completed which document
 * passport application is 1922, by the subject 48 years after the event, after WWI (primary document)
 * naturalisation by subject in 1906, 32 years after even before WWI, and I think that will be Oresberg, have to read the writing that has then been scanned (primary document)
 * census detail completed by elder sister's husband, and then transferred to concatenated schedule (secondary document); schedule says "Hun Slovak" so the pasted transcription is not accurate &hellip; Dressmaker in a private family could mean a range of things
 * education of kids today, and kids then and the term "school" are different, says can read and write, so could have been private tuition, who knows, have to dig into education in the country, religion of people. Could be teaching language, either teaching English as second language.

They are the same person through time, the people and dates tie together, so then whether it is the person or not.


 * So if no more data are available, we will have to make decision from what we have. I agree that the dates of the three documents tie together and so they are documents of the same person. I am just not sure if Ethel Julia Cablk described by these three documents is the same person as the linguist and translator Ethel J. Cablk. Trenton Evening Times state in 1920 that linguist Ethel J. Cablk was "born in what is now Czechoslovakia", received her education in Budapest (it is very improbable that it was some sort of non-school education, especially if she did not come from Budapest) and in the United States worked for some International Institute. The "other" Ethel Julia Cablk was probably born in Hungary proper, i.e. outside the territory of later Czechoslovakia, allegedly did not have school education, and her only occupation in 1910 was a dressmaker. I admit that the problem of the birthplace can be caused by a mistake in the sources and that the occupation could have changed substantially between 1910 and 1920, but do we really have something that makes these two to be one? Besides the unusual name I find only three hints: 1) they both lived in the similar time; 2) they immigrated to the United States (although the sources seem to differ in their place of origin); 3) they were both in touch with somebody called Novomesky (the translator co-worked with Ludovit Novomesky and the dressmaker shared household with several Novomeskys). Is it enough? I would like to say it is, but I am really hesitant… --Jan Kameníček (talk) 14:04, 23 March 2020 (UTC)


 * I think I’ve got it, I’ve found an article by Etelka Cablk ("Etelka" being a pet name version of Ethel) where she speaks about her courses of dressmaking. Now I feel more confident with the conclusion that it is one person. Thanks again for getting all the census and other data. --Jan Kameníček (talk) 20:05, 23 March 2020 (UTC)


 * Okay, fwiw I see no records for Etelka Cablk. — billinghurst  sDrewth  09:24, 24 March 2020 (UTC)

Passport
Name: 	Ethel Julia Cablk Age: 	43 Birth Date: 	12 Feb 1874 Birth Place: 	Europe, Czechoslovakia Residence Place: 	Newark Trenton, New Jersey Passport Issue Date: 	16 Aug 1922 Father: 	Stephen Cablk Has Photo: 	Yes arriving USA, September 1903
 * National Archives and Records Administration (NARA); Washington D.C.; Roll #: 2083; Volume #: Roll 2083 - Certificates: 212476-212849, 15 Aug 1922-17 Aug 1922

Naturalisation
Name: 	Ethel Cablk Record Type: 	Petition Birth Date: 	12 Feb 1874 Birth Place: 	Oresberg Hungary Arrival Date: 	22 Sep 1903 Arrival Place: 	New York Petition Place: 	New York, USA Petition Number: 	10786
 * Index to Petitions for Naturalizations Filed in Federal, State, and Local Courts in New York City, 1792-1906; NAI Number: 5700802; Record Group Title: Records of District Courts of the United States, 1685-2009; Record Group Number: RG

Census
Name: 	Ethel Cablk Age in 1910: 	36 Birthplace: 	Hungary Home in 1910: 	Bronx Assembly District 34, New York, New York Street: 	Crotona Ave Race: 	White Gender: 	Female Immigration Year: 	1903 Relation to Head of House: 	Sister-in-law Marital status: 	Single Father's name: 	Stephen Cablk Father's Birthplace: 	Hun Slovak Mother's Birthplace: 	Hun Slovak Native Tongue: 	English Occupation: 	Dressmaker Industry: 	Private Family Employer, Employee or Other: 	Wage Earner Attended School: 	No Able to Read: 	Yes Able to Write: 	Yes Out of Work: 	N Number of weeks out of work: 	0 Neighbors: Household Members: Name 	Age Ludwig Novomesky 	48 Paulina Novomesky 	44 Emil Novomesky 	21 Samuel Novomesky 	12 Stephen Cablk 	78 Ethel Cablk 	36 Ernestine Pales 	38 Susan Cerstock 	16
 * 1910 USA

Trenton Evening Times (Trenton, New Jersey)
"Article talks about party at the International Institute which seems to be an educational place, Ethel to be a hostess"
 * Trenton Evening Times (Trenton, New Jersey) > 1922 > January > 26